unfiltered therapists podcast Episode transcripts
Episode 12 - the save of his life with former NHL goalie Corey hirsch and Kristy Thackeray
Kristy Thackeray (00:03.112)
Joining us, my name is Kristi Thackeray. I'm one of the therapists here at Kindred Roots. And today I am joined by Corey Hirsch. Corey Hirsch is a Canadian former professional goaltender. Corey played majority of his NHL career with the Vancouver Canucks. You were a former goaltender coach with St. Louis Blues and the Toronto Maple Leafs. And then prior to your NHL career,
You were also a goaltender for Team Canada in the 1994 Olympics, winning the silver medal in the 94 Olympics after the loss to Sweden in a shootout, which we will talk a little bit about that later on. You were also a sports analyst with Sportsnet on NHL Sportsnet. And then you are currently a co -host of a podcast called Blindsided with the psychiatrist, Dr. Diane McIntosh. So, Corey, most...
Recently, I guess, you wrote a book, National Best Seller. I actually have a copy here, The Save of My Life. So excited to talk about this. I could not put it down. And it kind of all come out of an article in the Players Tribune about your own struggles with your with your own mental health.
Corey Hirsch (01:17.583)
Yeah, you know, there was, when I got diagnosed was probably somewhere around 1997. So it's interesting that it took 20 years.
Kristy Thackeray (01:27.016)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (01:29.999)
for the Players Tribune article came out that it took me 20 years to feel comfortable to be able to tell my story, right? And that was due to, obviously there was a stigma, there was lots of the masculinity portion of it, but just society -wise we weren't really accepting of mental health issues. So I had met a player.
back in 2017 that was in a, he was actually an active player in the NHL. Of course I was retired at the time. And he was in a treatment facility for alcohol and drug rehab in Arizona. And through an agent friend of mine, I was talking and it was his client. And I said, well, I'll go talk to him. I'll go have coffee with him. So I went to have coffee with this player and I'd never really told anybody other than for close family and friends, my mental health issues. And as we're,
Kristy Thackeray (01:56.264)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (02:23.202)
having coffee, I sat there and I'm like, you know, this player, this guy, really not good guy, I won't say who it is, of course, privacy and confidentiality, but I was just like, you know, if he's in alcohol and drug rehab, there's obviously some issues there. And I'll tell him my story, maybe it'll help. So I spill my story to him and I just start talking. And he looks at me after about 10 minutes, 15 minutes, and we tell my story and he goes, oh my God, that's what happened to me. And he's like, and his mom had to resuscitate him twice from fentanyl overdoses.
Kristy Thackeray (02:26.024)
Yep.
corey Hirsch (02:53.298)
So it was there and then it just kind of clicked. It was like, wow, you know, I need to get my story out there if there's other people and other players that need to hear that I could help. You know, so fast forward, I met some people, talked to the NHL players, Tribune came out, said they wanted to do an online publication. And when this online article came out, I was terrified. I was like.
Kristy Thackeray (03:00.872)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (03:14.608)
What's gonna happen here? You know because I'd never told my story the stigma all that stuff and when it hit the article hit It had like two million hits in under an hour. It went viral and I've never had anything, you know Here's a you know, it's like LeBron James territory Derek Tiger Woods like their articles go like that and it's still one of the most online publications clicked on in players Tribune history, so From there, you know, it just exploded into this big mental health thing that I was able to go and help people and
Kristy Thackeray (03:25.032)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (03:44.744)
ended up in more detail writing a book. The book is, it's interesting because people, not people, but just in general.
Other athletes have come out with stuff as a sports book, you know, with with other stuff or their problems inside. This is a mental health book. This isn't a this isn't a sports book. This is a mental health book with sports stories, not a sports book with mental health stories. So, you know, it's it's something that I think and hope that has helped a lot of people. I put a lot of information in there. I've never read the final edit. No, I've wrote I wrote I had I wrote most of the book.
Kristy Thackeray (03:59.036)
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, really? Yeah.
corey Hirsch (04:25.126)
You know, I wrote almost all the book. I had someone initially write it, and then I went over and rewrote almost the whole thing. And then you have what's called a punch writer. A punch writer goes in and brings it to life, right? Because I don't write at a professional level, right? So, and the punch writer just, he's the same guy that wrote the Player's Tribune article.
Kristy Thackeray (04:26.004)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (04:46.498)
He just got it like he just understands it and he knows and when he when he wrote it and I and I kind of reread parts of it He just brings it to life and he nailed it exactly what it's like and then so The final edit though. I'll probably never read it. I mean I lived it right and and
Kristy Thackeray (04:54.504)
Yeah. Yeah. No. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (05:05.042)
It's more for other people than for me. And hopefully we've helped a lot of people by understanding that mental health and OCD and a little bit of different stuff in there that maybe they can relate to it. Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (05:18.12)
Well, there's a, so I have to admit, I read the Players Tribune back in 2017 when it came out. It blew my mind because from like, I've known you for a long time. And so from like looking from the outside in, I was like, I was flabbergasted. I had no idea that you were going through all these things.
And, you know, like, it was like, oh, wow. And then when the when the book came out, like, I actually just purchased it a couple weeks ago, I, I could not put it down. I started reading it Friday night, I looked at the clock, it was like midnight. And I'm like, oh, shit, I got to get to bed. There's a part in the book I want to talk about that really sunk in for me. It's like the very first chapter, you talk about
corey Hirsch (05:52.495)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (05:59.347)
Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (06:05.152)
What it's like to have OCD or like, you know, we have those thoughts. They're just automatic thoughts. And you actually have this exercise in the book where you say like, close your eyes and imagine something horrific, the worst thing and go deep. And I had a thought and it was just like, you even said in the book, you're like, you probably that thought just went away. It was whatever thought I had, like, I can't even remember, but I just remember this wave of shame coming over my whole body. I'm holding your book and I'm like, holy shit.
corey Hirsch (06:11.507)
Yep.
corey Hirsch (06:19.539)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (06:33.651)
Mm -hmm.
Kristy Thackeray (06:35.176)
You know.
corey Hirsch (06:36.564)
Yeah, yeah, and that's well, that's where, you know, OCD is really misunderstood because it's been, it's been, you know, kind of labelled or talked about as something like, you know, hand washers and need and organize people. Well, and people are like, well, what's wrong with being really overly neat and organized and all that stuff? No, it's it's it's it's a much more broader perspective. Like I do everything in my head.
So you would never be able to tell that I have obsessive compulsive disorder. And people use it as a term like, oh, I'm so OCD and all that and whatever. Some people get upset about that. But have you not been able to leave your home for three days because the shelves are unorganized or because it's not the fact that it's clean, it's what you attach to it. It's that if your hands aren't clean,
Kristy Thackeray (07:05.448)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (07:31.797)
this is the thought in people's heads, well then they're gonna get sick, they're gonna get someone else sick, and then maybe that other person will die. Like it's a catastrophic spiral. So it's not about being clean or organized or neat. Yeah, we all like to have, it's about, most of my friends that have OCD at some point, it's become so debilitating that they've actually tried to take their own lives. So no, it's not really a cute funny thing. It's, you know, it's,
Kristy Thackeray (07:39.116)
Yeah. Yeah. No. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (08:00.535)
it can be deadly. And I wanted to kind of blow the doors off of that because it's such a wider perspective of that. But here's the other side of it is that it's treatable. And I want people to know that it's treatable. But when you're going through it, OCD is something that you don't really know what it is and you don't know what's happening. And so what happens is that you get stuck in it and then you get stuck in the shame and guilt of the thought and you become a prisoner of your own brain. Right. Like, for example,
Kristy Thackeray (08:07.128)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (08:28.927)
OCD has a harm aspect to it. The most kind, beautiful, loving people, a woman will have a baby and she loves her child more than anything. And most kind would never harm anything but gets a silly thought of, oh my God, what if I hurt my baby somehow? And then it spirals into like something that is catastrophic and they become prisoners in their own brain because they don't want to tell the doctor because then they think the doctor's gonna take the baby away, but nothing bad is gonna happen. It's just...
Kristy Thackeray (08:35.112)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (08:58.039)
a sticky thought that OCD just traps you in and makes you think the worst is gonna happen. And that's the best way I can describe it, that people with OCD are some of the most kind, beautiful, loving people, and they would never do anything to hurt anybody or anything, but it's also the same thing that attacks them. So having a thought like that is just the worst catastrophic thing. But it's only a thought. It doesn't mean anything. And that's...
Kristy Thackeray (09:04.392)
Yeah, yeah.
corey Hirsch (09:27.063)
The treatment for OCD is really learning that we have millions of thoughts every day. And most people can have a thought and just dismiss it as silly and it goes away. People with OCD get stuck on it. It's like our brain, something, wires just kind of disconnect and the thought doesn't stop, right? But it also keeps us prisoners. So that's why it's hard for people with OCD to go get help because there's an element of their brain that thinks that it might.
Kristy Thackeray (09:37.716)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you make.
corey Hirsch (09:54.465)
true, oh my god, what if that's true? I can't tell anybody that when it's actually just a thought and a mental health issue and it's treatable and when you get the help there's so much help for it. So that's the best way I can describe it. Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (10:05.044)
Yeah, and you make so many good points there too, because you know, even, you know, that I think too, like the stigma of it itself, right? Is that, and you mentioned like even as a new mom or, you know, and you, you talk about this in a book, this like, especially men's mental health, like to admit that there's a vulnerability to say like, hey, I see a knife and I have a thought and I can't, like, it just continues to be an obsession.
But I don't actually want to hurt someone because then what happens is in our society we just start labeling people right and I think that's really like how do we change that conversation though so more people will reach out more people will get help Education
corey Hirsch (10:32.119)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (10:39.443)
Yep.
corey Hirsch (10:47.063)
Yeah, it's education. It's why was I not taught this stuff in middle school or high school?
Why was I not taught about OCD? Why was I not taught about bipolar? Why was I not taught about schizophrenia? Why was I not taught about depression, anxiety? Okay, so if I'd have known, okay, these are the things of OCD. This might be the thing of OCD in high school, right? These are the signs and symptoms or whatever. I could have went, huh, maybe this is that OCD thing. I should go see somebody and ask and talk about it, right? Instead, because I'd never heard about it, I never knew about it, I was
Kristy Thackeray (11:00.456)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (11:22.425)
like, oh my God, right, what is this? And you just live with it and you just suffer with it. And if I was taught this stuff in high school, I would have never ended up in a suicide attempt. Right. And we can save so many lives through education. But mental health is like it's been such a taboo topic for so many years. Suicide is a taboo topic. Don't talk about it, blah, blah, blah. And to me, we're doing our children a disservice and we could save so many people's lives just by education. But we
Kristy Thackeray (11:30.184)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (11:52.298)
We still don't do it. And I've actually gone into high schools and that where parents have pulled their kids out of my talks because I talk about suicide and I talk about mental health because they think that their kids are going to get an idea. Well, I'll tell you what, if your kids are thinking about it, they've already been thinking about it long before I've gone in there. And in actual fact, I'm probably going to help them save themselves. It's been statistically proven that talking about suicide doesn't create more suicide. It actually saves lives, right? Because when we talk about suicide with people,
Kristy Thackeray (11:59.91)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (12:22.282)
The shame and the guilt gets less right it lets off and when a person that feels Bad about already thinking that if we make them feel even worse and keep burying it in the carpet That's just gonna make them feel worse and make them feel even like they're worse people But you know I let people know the word suicide needs to not be a taboo subject anymore Because we have all had thoughts Oh one day, you know like God it just what if it you know, what if I wasn't here anymore? That would be so much better
Kristy Thackeray (12:29.192)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (12:52.122)
blah blah blah. We have all had thoughts like that and it's fine to think about those things but there's a way better solution. That there is help, that there is hope, that that's not the thing to do. There is help but don't make people feel bad and bury them under the carpet even further for having a thought like that. It's just the thought and it's let's talk about it. Let's talk about what it is. Let's bring it up. Let's make you feel good about yourself and not bad and just then we can get you that
Kristy Thackeray (12:59.868)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
corey Hirsch (13:22.042)
help, you know, and we can get rid of these negative thinking patterns.
Kristy Thackeray (13:25.032)
I am speaking of suicide. So I know you had a, you had a suicide attempt. You write about it in your book. It's profound to read. There is one part though that you were standing on top of the Empire State Building with your mom. And I, I know who your mom is. And so, but I also was a mother. I remember the day, like one of my daughters told me that, you know, she was suicidal. And so I, I just want to like, that when you, when you, the moment you looked over at your mom and you're like, I want to jump.
My heart was just like, ugh. I was feeling for you, I was feeling for your mom, all of these things were coming up. And you're right, suicide is preventable. We need to talk about it more. There's no shame in it. I've had thoughts of suicide, I've had a suicide attempt. We need to have those conversations. How do we, sometimes you feel though it's like lip service. We keep saying it.
corey Hirsch (13:57.464)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (14:21.704)
Are we doing it? Are we? I know there was a suicide, two suicides recently in the news. Yeah, like what? How can we do better? No. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (14:25.496)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (14:30.584)
Yeah. Yeah.
Well, again, it comes back to education. We are not going to stop suicide. Suicide's been around since the beginning of time. OK? But can we put a dent in it? Absolutely we can. But so, you the story is, you know, the thing about the story is that with my mom is my mom had to remind me, my mom reminded me, I didn't even know I said that. My mom reminded me about it. And so that just, I spent three years.
Kristy Thackeray (14:51.592)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (15:02.256)
hiding from my OCD and hiding from mental health issues. And I don't even, those three years of my life, I barely remember any of it, right? So my mom having to remind me of that story just goes to show you how deep and how much, you know, how sick I was. But it's a good story in the sense that it's like, here's that, you know, it's the educate, my mom wasn't educated on this. She didn't know what to do. She, you know, and what an awful situation for her to be in. Christy, you telling me that your daughter,
came to you and said that, right? It's awesome that your daughter came to you and that's, you know, that's, that is, and she was able to feel comfortable. Now, when I go back to when we talk about suicide and why it's so important to have an open conversation and be able to allow people to share that is, Kristy what if your daughter came to you and said that, or my son came to me and said that, and we went, don't think that, that's a terrible thing to think, that's awful, that's horrible. Well, you're gonna just make that person feel worse and you're actually gonna make the...
Kristy Thackeray (15:50.208)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (16:02.01)
feel more alone and you're going to make them feel like it's going to put them deeper in the throes of of that you know those those thought processes so that's why we need to let people know that it's okay that you're having these thoughts right that person would will feel so much better that it's okay to think that like it's it's okay let's get you some help right and we make the person it's they got we make the person feel good about themselves and thank you for coming to me there's a better solution you know you don't need to do that right.
Kristy Thackeray (16:19.438)
Yeah Yeah
corey Hirsch (16:31.93)
But if your daughter come to you and you just made her feel worse, well, that's my point of us having open conversations and suicide can't be a taboo word anymore. We have to allow our children and people a safe space to say, hey, I'm thinking like this. Okay, let's get you the help you need. Let's go. So in those situations though that I was in, it wasn't like that. My mom didn't say back, I don't think like that. She just
didn't know what to do because she wasn't educated. So how are we going to put a dent in it? Well, making it a safe space for people to come talk to us, making it a safe word for people to say, hey, I'm thinking of this, and that we can get them to help. It's all based around education. And it's not an education of a 50 -year -old man anymore. It's education of our kids so that we can change the next generation of this.
Kristy Thackeray (17:17.864)
Yeah, yeah, and I agree with you. I think back even, you know, I don't know in school did you have a class it was career and life management? And you know, if we could incorporate like mental health talk and you know, emotional regulation, I didn't learn any of this stuff until I went to social work school. I had no clue. I was interested in reading your book because you talked also about when you were younger, likely having ADHD. And I kind of pieced together like,
corey Hirsch (17:33.016)
Yeah, no.
Kristy Thackeray (17:47.13)
you talked about, I think when you're on the phone, you kind of paced. And I noticed that in my own family with my brother, with my dad, or even myself, like when I'm on the phone, I don't sit still. I'm typically like walking around the house, just, you know. And so that was kind of interesting to read too, to kind of put pieces together. But going back to just like the conversations again, right? It's, you're right. It's education. It's like talking to our kids.
corey Hirsch (17:49.174)
Oh yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (18:13.416)
We used to think bringing up suicide would make someone think about it. And yeah, I think that's completely incorrect. And I think we have to like have this acceptance of, I call bullshit on people that tell me they've never thought about suicide ever in their life. I'm like, really? Well, I don't know what you're drinking or what you're doing, but like good for you, you know. I wanna talk a little bit about just, so.
corey Hirsch (18:22.368)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (18:32.952)
Yeah. Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (18:41.812)
Go back to like so from from 20 some 1994 when you kind of first noticed something was going on in your brain The players tribute come out in 2017. That's a long time We talked about like stigma even just for men's mental health to come out and so kind of going through that entire like process When from the time that you like went and first got help to a diagnosis, what was that like because even to get the OCD diagnosis was difficult because yours isn't
Like you said, your compulsions aren't physical, like you're not washing your hands, you're not doing that thing. So talk us through kind of like that journey.
corey Hirsch (19:25.176)
Yeah, so, realistic, I mean, it was three years and, you know, it was even three years after a suicide attempt that I finally had asked for help. But, I mean, to make a long story short, it got to the point where I had learned to live with OCD and this is what happens. People learn to live with it, but they're still struggling and you still learn to kind of, but you're constantly in the throes of...
Kristy Thackeray (19:41.192)
Yep.
corey Hirsch (19:53.448)
like you can't see it, but I was able to hide it. But I was living with it and every day was a battle. And you just kind of hope to figure it out one day to the point where after about three years of struggling with this, it got so bad that I wasn't able to live with it anymore. I'd lost 30 pounds.
Kristy Thackeray (20:11.4)
Mm.
corey Hirsch (20:13.95)
I was playing in the NHL at the time. I I played at like 175 I'm 145 pounds in front of my teammates like I'm skin and bones because I'm not I can't eat I can't like I'm just I'm becoming debilitated and So I had a choice Because yeah, you couldn't see it. But physically it was starting to take a toll on me, right? I was starting to all those things that are
are mental health signs. Being late all the time, like because I was so in my head, I'd always be late. You know, losing weight, sleeping or not sleeping, you know, oversleeping or not sleeping at all, withdrawing from friends, you know, not hanging out with my buddies and that, like they're all signs of mental health. Now, yes, some people, you know, we look at teenagers and we go, they just sleep all day, you know, they sleep a lot, okay. But if they haven't come out of the room,
Kristy Thackeray (21:03.276)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (21:09.434)
in two months. Okay, something's up, right? You know, another sign is, is I went from being on the NHL rookie team where I had a great year to the next year.
I couldn't even play in the minors, I was so bad, right? Your grades, when a student goes from an A to all of a sudden to an F, like average, it sums up, you know, that you don't just drop, like my play, every, same thing, so those are all mental health issues. So point being, and long story short, is that my teammates are starting to notice, I was starting to, I couldn't, I was playing terribly, and it was to the point where I was back on my knees, I was having anxiety and panic attacks so bad, I dropped all that weight, that I had a choice, I could either, you know,
Kristy Thackeray (21:31.432)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (21:50.138)
myself, which was, you know, or I could ask for help. And the way, you know, my brain was, I didn't know what was going on. I didn't know I had OCD. I didn't know it was a mental. I didn't know what it was. All I knew was I couldn't live like this anymore because it was, you know, so I actually, I reached out to a trainer and he got me the help. I mean, the story is a lot longer than that, but he got me the help and he had a psychologist come to my apartment in Vancouver and I still didn't know what was going to happen. My thoughts were, well,
the psychiatrist or psychologist, I'd never seen one before and I didn't, you know, I was like, whatever. And I was like, if there's, if the psychiatrist, psychologist thinks, tells me I'm crazy and that this isn't, then I'll just plan B, you know, and doesn't matter, you know, I won't be here anymore. And so I talked to the psychologist and I spilled everything after about 20 minutes. He's like, you have obsessive compulsive disorder. I'm like,
Kristy Thackeray (22:29.96)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (22:44.863)
I'm like, what the hell is that? Like, what are you talking about? It's like, it's a mental health issue. It's not curable, but it's highly treatable. You're going to go on to have a great life. Medication therapy, all good. And I just sat there bawling in front of them because the three years of my life gone. Like I said, that story about my mom didn't you remember, right? And just, you know, my NHL career gone, like all that stuff, because I wasn't educated on any of this stuff. The stigma to mental health, suicide attempts, you know, all that, that could have been prevented if I had been educated and just knew to go,
Kristy Thackeray (22:59.208)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (23:14.79)
talk to a therapist or a psychologist, right? And now it's not, it wasn't easy from there. There's still a stigma. It took me 20 years. It took me 10 years before I found somebody that could truly help me. It took me another 10 after that for the players tribunal. And that's way too long. I mean, we're in 2024. So the thought that the process has to be like kids.
Kristy Thackeray (23:29.448)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (23:35.041)
today, something's wrong in their brain, hey, you know what, something's up, I'm going to the doctor, the next day, go get help, get on with their lives, has no effect on their lives, right? Instead, it took me 20 years to feel comfortable to tell my story. But getting diagnosed was relieving, but it wasn't, you know, I mean, I still have to like do the work today to try and stay on top of my mental health issues and...
But hey, that's my life. That's what it is. And the reason I wrote the book is because I want people to look and say, hey, you know what? This guy was on the brink of death. And look at him today. He's got a book, played in the NHL, played in the Olympics, coached. And those aren't things to brag. Hey, look at me. I did all this. No, these are things like, hey, I have a pretty nasty mental health issue. It hasn't held me back from being successful. And you can too, right? And that's really the bottom line of all of it.
Kristy Thackeray (24:01.776)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
And you talked to about, well, I've seen you on podcasts talk about how like hockey has saved your life. But when you were on the ice, and I know you co -host a podcast called Blindsided where you do interview athletes and they talk about their own mental health. And you've said a lot of times, like you kind of leave it, whether you, you know, you leave it on like when you're on the court or on the ice, like.
corey Hirsch (24:35.329)
Oh yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (24:46.088)
your safe place was the ice. How do you like because it's such a it's an interesting kind of concept because when you're dealing with such a severe mental health diagnosis and issues and with our thoughts, right, because a lot of times we can't control our thoughts. How do you how did that the ice become the safe place when there is so much pressure to to perform when you're on the ice?
corey Hirsch (24:55.808)
Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (25:15.299)
Yeah, well, so the thing about hockey is people are like, well, there must have been so much pressure, like you just asked. You know, that must be the contributing factor to your OCD. Like, how is that? No, hockey is also a form of exercise, right? Whether you look at it as a professional sport or not.
Kristy Thackeray (25:15.72)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (25:32.908)
And when you exercise is one of the biggest ways you can help your brain with mental health, endorphins, all that stuff. So there's that portion of it. It gave me, hockey taught me resilience. It taught me courage growing up. It taught me how to take care of myself, how to do all those things, right? So hockey taught me the skills I needed to stay alive, those off ice skills, right? But on the ice, it also gave me a goal. It gave me teammates. It gave me things to go through, go to, to do and all that stuff. So that's,
Kristy Thackeray (25:44.04)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (26:02.834)
That's how hockey really saved my life and people are like did hockey do this to him like no the game itself is a great game All sport is great for mental health, right? The problem with sport is the people in it the people in it that take advantage of it the people in it that make it Abusive the people in it that you know the game itself any sport hockey tennis basketball I don't care what it is is awesome for mental health. Okay, and people are like, well, there's so much stress pressure being a goalie You know what stress there's stress and pressure everywhere. It's not just hockey
Kristy Thackeray (26:15.916)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (26:32.629)
You know what stress and pressure is? Is working construction and not having enough money to feed your family, you know?
That's way more stress and pressure than a goalie, to me, right? There's doctors, there's lawyers, there's everybody. That's stress. They have stress and pressure too. Don't say that hockey players have more stress than a doctor performing a surgery. No, no, no, no, no. So let's throw all of that out. Mental health doesn't discriminate. It doesn't care if you're construction, if you're a doctor, if you're, you know, what you're doing. It does not discriminate. It doesn't care what color you are, black, white, what ethnicity you are.
Kristy Thackeray (26:47.796)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (27:10.711)
It doesn't care. So let's start throwing out because you're a hockey player, this is why this happened to you. No, that's garbage. However, sport is awesome. And I always tell people, like, you know, don't be afraid. In Norway, they have a right to play. And it's called the right to play for children. And you have to put your, it's almost legalized, you have to put your child in sport.
Kristy Thackeray (27:12.712)
Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (27:34.374)
And their crime rates are down, their rates of suicides are down, everything's down statistically because it proves that belonging to a group and having sport and keeping your kids active changes everything. So, you know, as far as hockey goes, that's where explaining all of it, that's where I say hockey saved my life because it is great for mental health for everybody out there.
Kristy Thackeray (27:41.682)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. And I love to like, your brain wants to fool you into thinking, right? Like it's, it's the you can't tell someone, right? We can't tell because for fear, right? And of course, like in the 90s, right? Mental health wasn't talked about.
But the fact that you're part of a team, you're part of a community, right? And I think that's the piece that we're missing too in just our everyday lives. It's connection to people. And I think we need that more. I love that idea that Norway is doing to have kids in sports because we do know research shows exercise no matter what, just moving your body is good for your mental health. Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (28:38.988)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (28:40.327)
Yeah, when you make you learn how to how to be on a team or or you learn how to make friends with people you learn how to work with people right and This is the hard part of today's is that our kids are in a society where they don't have to leave the house to play with other people and Learn how to communicate face to face. They don't have to they can stay at home all day, right? And so, you know I'm worried for our next generation in that sense that I don't believe our brains were made We're wired to be able to work like that. I think human connection and it's been
Kristy Thackeray (29:07.848)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (29:10.233)
proven that human connection is an important thing for mental health, right? Face to face, being around other humans. I know that when I start to struggle, I will withdraw. I will barricade myself in my apartment because I don't want to be around anybody and that's the easiest thing to do, but it's the worst thing I can do because it actually contributes to depression and anxiety and I have to force myself to get out and be around other humans and that's when I start to feel better. But our brain tells us the exact
Kristy Thackeray (29:38.088)
Hmm.
corey Hirsch (29:40.089)
opposite, well let's just shut it down here, right? Let's just and when I struggle or if my friends haven't heard from me in two, three days, they'll text me, they'll be like, hey you doing alright? Like what's going on? I haven't heard from me in a couple days and I'll be like, yeah, yeah, I just got busy, whatever, you know, but it also shows me that people care about me, right? And I'll do the same for other people and that I appreciate it. It might be a day before I answer them back but I'm not doing it on purpose but I will text them back and let them know that I appreciate them, that I appreciate the fact.
Kristy Thackeray (30:08.956)
Yeah, yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah, yeah, and that's so important so you have I was actually gonna ask you that so you have that those like
corey Hirsch (30:09.946)
that they took the time to text me and it actually helps get me out of the house because it's like yeah okay and I'm all right all right Cory we gotta you know yeah you let's go for a walk let's go do something right go for a coffee go sit on the whatever right so yeah and that's that's the value of sport is is that it's my hockey buddies and my sport buddies are the ones that are calling me you know it gives you a sense of belonging community and friendship.
Kristy Thackeray (30:35.336)
the tribe of people around you that you know are your safe people and they check on you when they haven't heard from you. Because I think a lot of people do that, right? When we're feeling really overwhelmed or we're struggling, we feel like we don't want to burden other people, right? And so then we just, yeah, so we kind of close in. You're a father of three and in the book you did talk a little bit, one of your daughters came to you and said they kind of were having some thoughts as well. And just like from a parent's perspective and for parents that might be listening to this,
corey Hirsch (30:44.776)
Yes.
corey Hirsch (30:56.072)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
Kristy Thackeray (31:05.53)
What is something that you like, what's some what's some like suggestions or advice or, you know, what you would say to a parent? Because I know we even talked about suicide. If your kid comes to you, like what's not helpful to say? Like, what as a dad, when your daughter came to you, what, how did you manage that? How did you deal with that?
corey Hirsch (31:09.702)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (31:25.641)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (31:32.905)
Yeah, well, so here we always, because I knew my mental health issues historically, I had gone through them and I had struggled, of course. So I made it a safe, made sure that I made a safe space for my kids to be able to come and we always talked about it. Hey, dad's got some struggles. Hey, it's okay. You know, like I made it an open forum for all of us. And I remember saying to my kids,
Kristy Thackeray (31:35.004)
Hmm.
corey Hirsch (31:53.482)
Hey, if you ever have some funky thoughts or something, whatever, like, hey, you come to me, you can come talk to me. Like, you're not gonna, right? Like, it's all good. And we made it an open.
Kristy Thackeray (32:04.296)
Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (32:05.134)
free space or safe space for that to happen. So yeah, so my daughter and also genetics play a role in mental health. So if you're out there listening to this and you've struggled with depression, anxiety, you know, you have, doesn't mean that your child's gonna have OCD or bipolar or whatever it is, but it's possible they might. Like one of my children has OCD and so there's some genetics involved to it. So I know that. So should I be scared of that? No. But what I should do is be able to say,
Kristy Thackeray (32:33.736)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (32:34.988)
hey, you know, let's get this and get this checked. It's no different than someone that has a history of heart issues, as you know, Christy, right? Now you have to be able to genetically tell your kids and all that and hey, let's look out for this. Doesn't mean it's gonna happen, but hey, let's be aware of it so that we can get you help if you need it. So when my daughter came to me, it was a no -brainer. It's easy. Okay, hey, no worries. I'm excited you came to me. Thank you.
I'm not qualified to diagnose my children. Right. So it's like we don't just oh yeah you got that OCD thing here have a sandwich. Right. You know it's not like that. It's like OK let's take it to a psychiatrist psychologist. Let's get let's see what's going on. So from there we took her to a psychologist. Yes she gets diagnosed with obsessive compulsive disorder. But here's the here's the beauty of all of that. My daughter has never been in that place where I have where I was suicidal wanting to take my own life. Right. Just because.
Kristy Thackeray (33:04.548)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (33:31.5)
We made it an open forum in her house to talk about we were able to get her the help that she needs. We were able to get her on her way. Now does she still struggle? Absolutely. Right. It's like it's it's it's it's like anybody else. If you've got a history of diabetes or whatever in your family and there's some genetics involved in one of your children. Yeah. It's something they're going to have to manage the rest of their life. But she doesn't have to sit there and wonder what it is and suffer for three years like I did and end up almost taking your own life because you don't know what's going on. Right. That's.
the value in education and being and creating awareness, right, that my daughter has never gotten to that place. And like I say, yeah, she still struggles. She has to take care of herself, but she's on top of it. And she'll never get to that place where like, can you imagine if my daughter was never came to me and didn't know and something terrible happened and I never had that like, we'd be all be devastated. So that's the importance of having that conversation and a safe, open space in your home to be able to talk about it.
Kristy Thackeray (34:06.176)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's so important. And so I think I think that's like, that's such a good point, right? It's just having that safe space that they can come and talk to you about it. You talk a lot about just
getting therapy and doing the work for as a therapist myself and part of a group of therapists and someone seeking therapy, what were some of the things that like you found? Like, was there was there therapists that you were just like, oh, that was the most unhelpful thing ever? What? Yeah.
corey Hirsch (35:01.676)
Yeah, there's, well, then that's the thing that's...
Kristy Thackeray (35:01.832)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (35:06.028)
The first place you should go to is your family doctor if someone's struggling, right? That's the first place you go. Because, and your doctor can refer you, and people are afraid to go to their doctor because there's a bit of a person, now your doctor's seen and heard more weird crap than you can ever imagine. Your stuff is minimal compared to what they've probably seen in their day, and that's their job, is to be able to not judge and to get you the help in the direction you need. That's why they became doctors. So to be afraid of what your doctor's gonna think of you, don't even,
Kristy Thackeray (35:35.852)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (35:35.936)
throw that out the window, right? That's just like, so that's the first place you go. Then from there you go to referral, whatever. You may not connect with the person, it's more of a personal relationship. You may not connect, but if you don't, that's okay. Go to another one, go to another one, go to another one, right? And I probably saw six or seven.
different psychologists, psychiatrists, therapists before I found somebody that could really help me and clicked with me, right? The point is just because you go to one and you're like, oh, that was you. No, okay, so I guess that's it, I'm done. Yeah, there's no help out there. No.
Kristy Thackeray (36:01.352)
you
corey Hirsch (36:12.783)
Mental health is different in the sense that, you know, there's a kind of a, it's like a puzzle piece that, you know, some people are a little bit more educated in or know a little bit more and there's a relationship, it's a little different. So don't quit at one. If you gotta go to five or six or seven, keep going. There's always help is available, right? There's always a path ahead. But it takes a little bit more digging with mental health to find it because our brains aren't, our brains are
Kristy Thackeray (36:30.6)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (36:42.737)
like you know a broken wrist we see we get a you know we get an we get an x -ray done okay it's it's cut and dry it's a broken wrist.
we put a cast on it, you go away. Mental health, our brains are very complex, right? Like it's a little bit of a feeling out, finding out, trying to figure out what's going on. And it's a relationship between you and your therapist to try and figure out so that they can help you the best that they can help you. So I always say, you know, just because you went to one doesn't mean that, you know, sometimes it's five or six, it's just what it is. But just know and don't lose hope that there's always help available, that there is a path ahead.
Kristy Thackeray (36:59.848)
You
corey Hirsch (37:20.145)
You just need to do a little extra digging to find it. And if you're not well enough to be able to do that digging, well there's a buddy system, right?
have somebody help you. I've had to learn about the buddy system because with the ADHD stuff that I have, I can sit here for days and do nothing, right? Because my brain will just be like, let's just not do anything and it wants to. So there's things called like a buddy system where, you know, you just say, hey, you know, I have a buddy, you know, I struggle with it and I need to get my taxes done this week. Can you come over and sit with me and make me do my taxes?
Kristy Thackeray (37:37.824)
Yeah. Yeah. You talk about something really interesting too, because as like for, from my perspective and as a patient of the medical system.
corey Hirsch (37:54.991)
Just little things like that. Like same thing with finding a psychologist therapist. Hey, I'm really struggling. I'm having a tough time. Will you help me find somebody to go see? Right? That's the buddy system.
Kristy Thackeray (38:02.824)
It is interesting how like, yeah, there's no stigma of going and getting checked for a heart issue or whatever it is. And it's interesting too to me that throughout my journey in the medical system, my mental health was actually never something focused on. And that's kind of the disconnect, right? It's like, you know, which, which really surprises me still to this day and age and in families as well. It was your family like this, where it's like,
corey Hirsch (38:27.759)
Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (38:28.616)
I mean, even to have a conversation about mental health, it's just not, it wasn't like it didn't exist really. And even the family part of it. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (38:47.855)
Yeah, I mean, there's a lot to it. I mean, there's a lot to that statement you just made because it all comes back to mental health. All of it. If you break an arm, it comes back to mental health. You're worried about, will I be able to use my arm the way I used to? Right? Is it going to be the same? And then that causes stress and worry. And Christy, you know, with your issues, I mean, your issues were life or death. Like, the...
Kristy Thackeray (38:57.864)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (39:16.559)
How could that not affect worry every day and fear and your brain and just anxiety, right? But nobody talked to you about your...
Kristy Thackeray (39:27.016)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (39:27.345)
you're worrying your fear and they're giving you a teddy bear, oh here have this, you know, oh that'll make you feel better. Are you kidding me, right? No, like I'm terrified right now, right? And so, and it's even people, like people with cancer, there's the disease and then there's the disease behind the disease, which is mental health issue, right? Like people, you get diagnosed with cancer, the first thing is, oh my God, am I gonna die, right? Well, where is, that's a thought.
that becomes a mental health issue, right? So we need to start seeing that it all comes back to mental health and treatment, both whether it's physical and all that. So I love that you brought that up because, you know, and the thing about with my mental health issues is, yeah, nobody, you weren't, nobody talked about it because in the 50s, 60s and 70s, if you were seen as like a mental health issue, you dropped Uncle Joe off at the asylum for treatment, there was really,
Kristy Thackeray (39:56.296)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (40:24.403)
no treatment and maybe you saw him again and maybe you didn't and if you did he had electric shock therapy and was a completely different person right and and there was no treatment so it became a thing of to to fear and people thought that you could actually catch mental health issues right like like it was like a cold you know so you had a lot of people that I mean well let's be honest you had a lot of people that self -medicated with alcohol.
Kristy Thackeray (40:28.396)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (40:53.489)
Right. And if for those people out there that probably had a dad that was an abusive alcoholic or a mom that just because that was the only treatment that was available, they were self medicating, you know, and it's sad. And then what happens is, is then generations become that person was abused. It's, you know, because they had a parent with alcohol issues that was abusive. And then, you know, now they're messed up mentally and it's just it becomes a generational thing. Right. So that that's where so nobody ever talked about it. So now we're in a
Kristy Thackeray (40:58.628)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (41:23.443)
space 60 years too late, but at least we are in a space where, hey, it's OK to talk about it. But also now we're getting in a generation where people are going, I have a little, I have some anxiety. I can't go to work today. You know, there's.
Kristy Thackeray (41:24.136)
No. Yes.
corey Hirsch (41:38.703)
There's anxiety and then there's, you know, there's, and I, and I don't get me wrong. I have compassion, but we also have to be able to, you know, like, I don't feel great every day either, right? But I still gotta go to work or, you know, but that help is available and don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to say, but there's also a responsibility of a person to be part of their own recovery.
Kristy Thackeray (41:54.312)
Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (42:03.825)
Right? Like you have to take care of you. And we have to teach people how to take care of their brains. Meditation has been proven to rewire your brain and re and do all that. Meditation should become part of everyone's daily life. When I was a kid, people made fun of people that meditated. It's like, it's the best thing you can do for your brain, right? Like.
And I remember friends, oh, do you meditate because you're a goalie? And we used to joke about it and laugh about it, right? Now I do it every day. It's the best thing ever. It's so good for my brain. So finally now we're getting into the portion of life where we're allowing people to feel and be able to ask for help.
Kristy Thackeray (42:26.18)
Yeah. So if I could get a little bit of like for you, what does meditation like every day for you? What does that look like? Yeah. Yep.
corey Hirsch (42:53.745)
What is meditation for me? It's exercise. And I'm not perfect at it, right? Meditation for me is I set a timer for 10 minutes, that's all. Sometimes some people can do three. I started at like two minutes, three minutes, and I was like, this is, and I used to think that it was all about not having any thoughts, right? And don't have a thought and keep, no, it's about just sitting there and actually letting the thoughts roll in. And I actually sit,
And rather than push away the thoughts or anything like that, I let them come in and I just stay present and just know that they're there. And just sometimes they'll just listen to what my brain might have to say to me. But I don't put any judgment on it. I don't tag it. I don't say go away. I just let it be there and just let it sit. And then just.
Kristy Thackeray (43:22.152)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (43:41.745)
breathe and I set a timer for 10 minutes and once that 10 minutes is up, I'm up. But sometimes I have three minutes, some days I have two minutes, some days I have 20, right? But after I'm done, I just feel like so much more at peace. And I set a pillow or whatever. I sit in my car, the steering wheel, five minutes, right? Just breathe. That's really all I do, yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (43:52.14)
That's one thing I love so much about your book because you talk about your journey and and like you say, it's a mental health book with some sports added in. However, at the back of the book, you talk about the things that helped you and I think sometimes it's like, I think we need more of that because even as a therapist, I'm like, yeah, like we struggle with these things and I have clients that come in but it's the tools like how do we do it? And I love that.
I love what you just said, because I even incorporating like that mindfulness meditation in my life, like it has, because I think we're just like so the world we live in now, we're just go, go, go, which isn't helpful for ADHD either. Right. And so that kind of just centers us. I love that you talk about to like eating healthy exercise and therapy. And then one of the other things I love too, is you do talk about medication. You take medication. You're currently on medication. Um,
And that works for you. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (44:59.889)
Yeah. Yeah. Well, and we make fun of people for being on meds because that's, you know, and, and, and well, you know, I mean, I'm okay with joking about things like, I mean, we're going to make fun and have that stuff, but we can't, but to, but to make someone feel crazy or because they're on medication. Look, I didn't ask for OCD. It didn't say God or the universe. Hey, give me this. That sounds fun. Just like people don't ask for cancer. Like, why would you ask for that? Right.
Kristy Thackeray (45:15.368)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (45:28.145)
But people with cancer need medication to be able to help themselves so that they can continue to live and their body can function. Well, something in my brain doesn't function properly. I didn't do that. I didn't ask for that. I didn't do something horrible so that that would happen, right?
Physically, that's just what it is. So I need medication to regulate whatever it is that my brain doesn't have that someone else might have more of or less of. So why am I made fun of or treated differently or seen less than because I have something wrong with my brain that I didn't ask for, right? So I take meds to help that. Now, I don't like being on meds more than anybody else. I don't push farm. I don't push any of that. Like nobody wants to be on medication for, you know,
Kristy Thackeray (45:46.66)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (46:13.843)
It's something that happens in their bodies because you know, we would rather because you know, but that's what it is. You need it. It's just what it is, right? I'd love to do everything naturally too and have the perfect body and be the perfect human and live till I'm 200 years old. But that's not life. That's not the way it works. So why do we make fun of people that are on medication and people are still afraid to be on medicine? Look, would I rather not be on medication for my vein? Would I rather not have OCD? Absolutely. But you know what I'd rather I'd rather be
Kristy Thackeray (46:20.012)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (46:43.763)
I'd rather be present for my kids and I'd rather be able to be the best person I can be and I'd rather be able to not have to struggle every day just to get out of bed, right? And you'll know when you need medication like you'll know when it's enough is enough. And that's we might be over medicating people right now, but that's fine. Whatever. But I know when I need to be because I'm not a functioning participant in society and I know how hard it is. And sometimes I just need a little bit of help to get back in the game, which may be
Kristy Thackeray (46:48.012)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (47:13.683)
makes me, I feel a better person for everybody else. And if you're on meds out there, you're no less of a person. You're actually, I think you're a stronger person than the person that struggles every day and isn't good for the people around them and all that because they don't want to be on meds. Now, there's great things coming in plant medicine, psilocybin, ketamines, all that stuff. And we need some, obviously the government and all that have to get on board.
Kristy Thackeray (47:15.24)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (47:43.603)
But there's some great natural things coming too as well. And we need to use every tool we have.
Kristy Thackeray (47:48.84)
Yeah, yeah.
corey Hirsch (47:51.963)
to fight mental health issues, right? You would never look at somebody with cancer and go, yeah, you can't use that because, yeah, it's not whatever. Give them every opportunity they can to be able to fight, to be able to live. And it's the same thing with mental health, right? Let's give everybody the tools that they can to be able to fight this. So yeah, I talk about medication and...
Kristy Thackeray (48:16.428)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (48:18.225)
Yeah, all parents fight. I'll see them. They're like asking me questions where they should, whether or not they should medicate their kid. One parent's like, absolutely not. The other one's like, and they're fighting. And yet their kid can't get their head off their desk and can't go to school, right? Like your kid has no quality of life. Give them the opportunity to get back in the game and then you can go from there. And sometimes medication, if I'm not on medication,
It actually is more harmful because I can't process the therapy I'm getting because my brain's an inferno. And you're using a water hose to try and put it out. That's the same thing as not, right? Like it's not working. So bring out the artillery, let's put the fire out a little bit and then my brain can accept the therapy and then maybe I can get off medication, right? That's the other side of it too.
Kristy Thackeray (48:45.116)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and I, you know, even personally, like I'm on so much medication that it never occurred to me, like, I had a little episode and I don't know, 2013. And, and when I talked to my doctor, they're like, Oh, you're not on medication for men for, you know,
anxiety or anything? I'm like, no. And they're like, oh, and yeah, and I've been on it since then. And I, yeah, like you said, it kind of calms everything a little bit. And are you still even partaking in therapy as well right now? Always. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (49:38.225)
Always, I'll never be out of therapy. I'll never be out of therapy. Sometimes I'll go.
Kristy Thackeray (49:41.716)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (49:44.245)
Sometimes if I'm struggling, I'll go six months with every week, every second week or whatever. And then sometimes when I'm doing over the course of my life, sometimes when I'm doing really well, I'll go once every three months, right? Once every six months. I'll never be out of therapy. It's just, it's like somebody again with diabetes in the sense that they'll never ever not have to go to a doctor and get their stuff checked and regular maintenance. That's just who it is. That's who I am.
Kristy Thackeray (50:10.696)
Mm
corey Hirsch (50:13.873)
The issue with that is that we need to make it affordable for people to go, right? Because not everybody can do that. But that's a bigger issue than I can partake in because I don't, you know, that's not my area of life is to try to get people to get the help, to try to, you know, be an advocate for people to be able to afford it. But in the same sense, you know, we need to start making it affordable for people.
Kristy Thackeray (50:40.136)
Mm -hmm.
corey Hirsch (50:41.137)
And there's lots of different ways, but that's a whole different topic than for today. But yes, I go regularly for maintenance, and sometimes I go because I really am struggling.
But here's the thing is that those days that I'm really struggling, I know that the tomorrow is going to be better, right? Then I have this thing just get to tomorrow. Tomorrow is always better, right? Just sometimes you just like, I'll give you, I was, I had last night, I wasn't, I was having a tough night last night just because some of my life things are going on because I'm human and we have life stuff. I was in bed at seven 30 cause I know just, you know, let's just go lay in bed. Tomorrow's a better day. I woke up today. I'm.
Kristy Thackeray (51:13.896)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
corey Hirsch (51:23.761)
I'm having a way better day. I'm back. I'm active. I'm having a good time with you on this podcast. But last night, man, I know just get to tomorrow. Right. I know that. So sometimes, OK, going to bed at seven and watching a movie and just laying there. That's self care. Right. Just getting to more to tomorrow with self care. So there's all those there's these little things that that that really helped that I've learned personally. Now, today, if I was really struggling again, I might call my
Kristy Thackeray (51:39.528)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (51:53.715)
therapists and say, hey, you got appointment today? Like, let's chat. I'm not having a great day. But I know that today I need to eat well.
I need to maybe call a friend. I need to maybe I need to go and exercise. Maybe I need to go for a walk. I know that because yesterday wasn't a great day that just because you know to start a little more self care today, right? And then and then it's it's a you know, it's it's all those things. So yeah, that's an example of what I'm going through right now.
Kristy Thackeray (52:09.512)
And I love to, because I hear compassion in that. And I think sometimes we're our own worst enemy. Like our brains are so, I don't like, I'm sure your brain, like my brain, like even to do this podcast with you, I was like, you're going to mess it up. You're going to, you know, like, right? Like my brain's just sabotaging it all, but I'm like, no, just center. Like, so, and we have to show ourselves compassion. And I think that's sometimes what we miss is just like, you know, being kind to ourselves.
Um, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, thank you! We're doing good! Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (52:53.777)
Yeah, yeah. Well, your brain's gonna lie to you. We've been conditioned to go to the worst case scenario, right? Like your brain's gonna lie to you. Like, before this, your brain's like...
trying to read the future and catastrophe and all that, right? I think you're doing very well. No, we're doing great. We're having a great conversation, right? Yeah. So your brain, what's the proof of what, your brain lied to you, right? So a lot of times, and that's a portion with OCD is that your brain's lying to you, but we, for whatever reason, we want to believe, well, why would my brain lie to me? Well, guess what? It just does, you know? And it's part of self -compassion. But I've recently gone through a lot of self -loathing.
Kristy Thackeray (53:09.32)
Yeah, yeah
corey Hirsch (53:36.477)
and learning how to love myself and all that stuff. I'm very hard on myself and I'm very, like perfectionism is, and you know, and what I've learned in the last little bit with what I've been going through is the difference between self -love and self -hate. And I can honestly say today that I love myself and that I'm proud of myself. I'm telling you, a year ago I couldn't do that, right? Because I was so into, and doesn't matter, but what I've learned about self -love is that self -love is exercising. Self -love is,
Kristy Thackeray (53:39.604)
Yeah, yeah.
corey Hirsch (54:06.387)
eating well. Self -love is, you know, doing things like not drinking or doing good things for you, being kind, being compassionate, right? The ways we hate ourselves and the way we do things to ourselves is that we try to be perfect, perfectionism. You know, the seven deadly sins, lust, envy, greed, all those things, those are all ways we punish ourselves. Alcohol is a way we punish our bodies, right? And I'm not here to preach abstinence on alcohol or drugs or whatever, but when some
is doing that to excess their self -medicating and they're actually punishing themselves right so what do we learn about all that is is that I don't look at exercise anymore I used to look I hate look nobody likes to like store some people do but I used to look at exercise like all people tell me to exercise I got to take care of my body so I guess I got to do it I don't look at it like that I look at it now is my body is a separate entity for me and it's like
Kristy Thackeray (54:41.332)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (55:02.449)
I'm going to show it some love. I'm going to go exercise because my body likes that, right? My brain might not like that. My, you know, Cory might not, but it's a way to show myself love. And I don't look at it as, as I look at it as loving myself. I'm going to eat, you know, well today because.
Kristy Thackeray (55:10.528)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (55:20.785)
You know, my body needs it and it's the way my body's, I'm gonna show my body love. I've separated it. What happens is when I eat poorly, well, how do you feel after? You feel gross because your body's like, ugh, why did you do that to me? Because, you know, because Cory wanted to eat poorly because it tastes good, yeah. But my body's like, you know, screw you. This is what you just did to me, you know? So it's a whole, I know it's probably a little bit of a different concept, but it's however,
Kristy Thackeray (55:42.796)
Yeah. Yeah.
corey Hirsch (55:50.739)
works for you. But that's how I try and look at self love now and self hate. And I used to get the, I'll just stand in front of the mirror, tell yourself you love yourself 10 times every morning and guess what? Eventually you'll believe it. Well, guess what? I tried that for a month. I'm like, yes, I love myself now. It doesn't work like that, right? It's doing the little things for your body.
Kristy Thackeray (56:09.188)
Yeah, and this is a never ending journey. And so for people, I am aware of time and you probably have things you got to get to. I could talk all day to you though.
corey Hirsch (56:13.009)
that show you love, right? Doing the little things for your brain, like meditation. That's how self -love works. It took me a long time to get there. Boy, it sure did. And it's not a process, like I said, where for a month you go and tell yourself you love, and all of a sudden you do. You know, that's a nice thing. Yes, it's part of the process, but it's not the only process.
Kristy Thackeray (56:29.544)
If there are, you know, parents or like, are you, do you have any upcoming speaking engagements at schools or anywhere that people could check you out?
corey Hirsch (56:43.857)
Oh, me too. Absolutely, yeah.
corey Hirsch (56:54.158)
Yeah, I don't, you know, typically I speak for corporations and all and a different stuff. But, you know, if anybody wants to get a hold of me for speaking or anything, my website is coreyhurst .com. You can follow me on Instagram, coreyhurst72. You know, you can reach out to me there.
Kristy Thackeray (57:04.72)
No.
corey Hirsch (57:12.963)
You know, so there's lots of places to get a hold of me on my website, there's a ton of information. You know, and just my book is out there, so you know, hopefully, Kristy, I'm glad you're the one person that read it. Thank you, it's made it a national bestseller because you read it. So, but it's like, yeah, no, it's just, it's, I love what I do. You know, I loved playing hockey, I loved playing in the NHL, I loved all that, but.
Kristy Thackeray (57:28.648)
Hmm.
corey Hirsch (57:39.867)
But I believe that the meaning of life now because of what's happened with me is it's all about helping people. You know, when I was playing hockey, it was all about me, me, me, my Cory, what are people saying about me? What did we win last night? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you get lost in this self -importance thing. And what I found out when I was done the game and the article came out was his life is about helping other people. Right. So, you know, let's get out there and help each other. And when you help people, it comes back to you tenfold. Right. So it's a beautiful thing.
Kristy Thackeray (58:00.068)
Thank you so much. Oh, well, you know, I have to challenge you. I don't think you were all about you, you, you, because I remember 1995, inviting this, you know, 13 year old little girl up to see a Vancouver Canucks game in Calgary. And then we went out for supper with you guys after and I was just like in awe. I still remember that it was like, it was like a little mini wish foundation trip. I call it kind of I don't.
corey Hirsch (58:09.821)
So if you know I try and I get out there I speak I speak publicly I speak as much as I can on mental health and hopefully we can help some people so Thank you for having me today Christy. That's been amazing. You did great. It's amazing. We did great
Kristy Thackeray (58:28.968)
You know, like, um, and yeah, it was just, yeah, it was one of the honestly, I still, I still remember that. So, you know, just like looking up to this, like, oh my God, this like guy is in the, in the, in the NHL and I'm here to watch and yeah, it was pretty cool. There you go. Yeah. See that's yeah. Oh, thank you.
corey Hirsch (58:30.235)
Hahaha.
corey Hirsch (58:45.179)
No, I love that. I love that we were able to do that. So that's awesome. Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (58:59.432)
Yep, yep. Thank you. Yeah, go ahead and tell people it's... Yeah, yeah.
corey Hirsch (59:01.915)
Well, Chrissy, what is that? That's me helping other people, right? That's what it's all about. But like, you know, just what you've been through and your strength and you're inspiring, right? You're inspiring. Yeah, like, I mean, it's a...
You know, we didn't really know how it was gonna turn out for you. I mean, to be honest, back then we didn't and you know, our hearts were with you. But the strength and the courage that you have is like, it's inspiring and how you're helping people today, right? Again, what's it all about? Eventually we have our struggles. Well now, how can I make this, how can we make our struggles?
Kristy Thackeray (59:30.14)
Yeah, and that's like, that's the, that's the whole I think like when you can get to that, like that radical acceptance and like, share your story and especially like, I feel more women are apt to go and seek help. So, you know, men's mental health, like it's still we have a long way to go.
corey Hirsch (59:38.011)
be able to be and help other people, right? That's what it's all about. So we always look at, yeah, these times were shitty times, boy, they weren't good, but guess what? What can I do with that, right? What good can come out of that? And that's what's so cool about all this. So, yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (59:51.144)
I'm mad that I didn't read your book sooner, but I also know that sometimes the universe has a way because I might not have been ready to hear the information yet. And so when I read it, it was like the timing, it was just like where I was in my life and just everything. It just, it really spoke to me and I honestly couldn't put it down. People can order it on Amazon too or through your website. Okay, awesome. This will now be in our Kindred Roots.
corey Hirsch (01:00:07.387)
Yeah.
corey Hirsch (01:00:16.379)
Yeah.
Kristy Thackeray (01:00:19.644)
library. So if anybody here in the clinic wants to borrow it too, maybe one day I'll get a signed copy. Okay. Well, thank you so much, Corey. Thank you so much. I really enjoyed this. Yeah. All right. I'm going to stop the recording really right now.
corey Hirsch (01:00:30.905)
Mm -hmm. Yep. Yep. Awesome.
corey Hirsch (01:00:41.115)
Love it. Oh, well, I'll get one for a yearbook too. You can sign one for me. You've been through a lot too. Thanks, Christie. No, me too. Anytime. Okay.